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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#61 [url]

Apr 8 17 10:20 AM

I noticed there seems to be no sel-sync unit. I guess I'll have to cut to all three tracks at once unless these machines are set up differently than the Ampex 300-3's.

Tom, Bob, Doc, Chuck, etc... any of you guys know?

I'll add the picture to this post as well.

 image

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

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chetdelcampo

Silverado

Posts: 101 Member Since:27/03/2013

#62 [url]

Apr 8 17 10:25 AM

silvertone wrote:

I know Scotch 220, 222 etc would be the best tape for these type machines but since they can be gotten anymore what modern equivalent will work?  Does anybody know?  Does JRF make an equivalent?

Wee bit jealous Larry. Bold move & very nice combo!   

Modern tape formulations are a hole other can of worms it seems.  There are folks that find RMGI more of a stable bet (in so far as binder & integrity) and, there are those that feel more-so that way about ATR. I'm about to find out myself as my refurbed 440 1/2" 4trk is just about ready for action (along side a humble Neotek series 1 8trk & an ecoplate). 

Generally, different batches (of either) are the wild card wherein variations can ensue.  It seems the place to start would be to get a role of each and get on with things.
I'll be doing so in the upcoming weeks.   I hope we can both find some relatively stable options.  Some would argue it's the biggest challenge of tracking to tape these days.  
Fingers crossed that the good folks @ ATR/RMGI continue to up their game.  

 

Last Edited By: chetdelcampo Apr 8 17 10:28 AM. Edited 2 times.

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gold

Platinum Blonde

Posts: 1,494 Member Since:27/01/2011

#63 [url]

Apr 8 17 1:23 PM

I had to crank the tape tension up to get the best performance from my Telefunken M15. It was made before back coated tapes were in use. When Bob Shuster, who did the restorration came by to install a new head he gave me a funny look when he saw how high I had the tension set. Performance was good but not as good with higher tension. After the W+F measured 0.0002 %, better than the Studer A80 he smiled. You might need to ride the tape tesion adjustment if you are playing all sorts of tape formultions.

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chance

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,634 Member Since:30/01/2011

#64 [url]

Apr 8 17 5:13 PM

silvertone wrote:
I noticed there seems to be no sel-sync unit. I guess I'll have to cut to all three tracks at once unless these machines are set up differently than the Ampex 300-3's.

Tom, Bob, Doc, Chuck, etc... any of you guys know?

I'll add the picture to this post as well.

 image

I personally have never seen a 3 track 300 with sel sync. Dosen't mean they don' exist. I have seen and had 350's where you can monitor off the rec heads for sel sync. Pic sure looks purdy

Chance Pataki The Musicians Workshop www.the-musicians-workshop.com musicians.workshop@gte.net

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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#65 [url]

Apr 9 17 7:40 AM

chance wrote:

silvertone wrote:
I noticed there seems to be no sel-sync unit. I guess I'll have to cut to all three tracks at once unless these machines are set up differently than the Ampex 300-3's.

Tom, Bob, Doc, Chuck, etc... any of you guys know?

I'll add the picture to this post as well.

 image

I personally have never seen a 3 track 300 with sel sync. Dosen't mean they don' exist. I have seen and had 350's where you can monitor off the rec heads for sel sync. Pic sure looks purdy

The Ampex 300-3 that I almost bought from Jack Miller had the Sel Sync on it, usually sits below the three racks of electronics.   I'll post a picture later when I'm at the studio.

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

www.silvertonemastering.com

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waltzingbear

Platinum Blonde

Posts: 1,231 Member Since:16/07/2012

#67 [url]

Apr 9 17 12:34 PM

the 300 could be ordered with sel-sync, it consisted of a number of units to do it, sorta after the fact connecting and handling. Also used Lo-Z Pb heads and transformers to make it work correctly as well as the sel box. Electronics were 351 style.  Refurbed a 1" 8 track 300 last year.

As far as tape goes, you might try some of the "other" formualtions of RMG, such as the SM468 http://www.recordingthemasters.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/fiche_sm468_rtm_26_07_2016-web.pdf

I haven't seen one of those for at least 30 years, so don't have anything much to say about the decks, other than I seem to remember thinking they were an Ampex knock off.

Alan

Alan Garren
Waltzing Bear Audio

Last Edited By: waltzingbear Apr 9 17 1:10 PM. Edited 1 time.

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scullyfan

Platinum Blonde

Posts: 1,568 Member Since:27/07/2011

#68 [url]

Apr 9 17 3:06 PM

waltzingbear wrote:
I haven't seen one of those for at least 30 years, so don't have anything much to say about the decks, other than I seem to remember thinking they were an Ampex knock off.

Alan


​Ha. The Ampex is a Magnetophon knockoff.

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waltzingbear

Platinum Blonde

Posts: 1,231 Member Since:16/07/2012

#69 [url]

Apr 9 17 3:30 PM

most certainly!

but they did do a lot to improve the device, perhaps not quite as much as Willi Studer did however. I'll probably get in trouble for that remark.

Cheers
Alan

Alan Garren
Waltzing Bear Audio

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jzombie

Gold Finger

Posts: 541 Member Since:07/02/2011

#73 [url]

Apr 9 17 6:51 PM

Bing Crosby was heavily involved in the development of the Ampex 200, investing a lot of money in the company, as he wanted to be able to pre-tape his radio show.  In fact I believe it was Crosby who gave Les Paul his first tape machine.  

Larry, glad to hear you were able to find a machine, look forward to hearing what transpires...

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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#74 [url]

Apr 9 17 7:20 PM

waltzingbear wrote:
the 300 could be ordered with sel-sync, it consisted of a number of units to do it, sorta after the fact connecting and handling. Also used Lo-Z Pb heads and transformers to make it work correctly as well as the sel box. Electronics were 351 style.  Refurbed a 1" 8 track 300 last year.

As far as tape goes, you might try some of the "other" formualtions of RMG, such as the SM468 http://www.recordingthemasters.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/fiche_sm468_rtm_26_07_2016-web.pdf

I haven't seen one of those for at least 30 years, so don't have anything much to say about the decks, other than I seem to remember thinking they were an Ampex knock off.

Alan

Jacks 300-3 came from Ampex with the sel sync installed. Lee Hirshburgh did a lot of work with Jack on that machine.  The original Batman theme was recorded on it.  Waylon Jennings, Wayne Newton, etc... Would have been a nice machine to get.

Thank you for the suggestion on the tape Alan. I will check it out.

Presto supplied many custom machines for Muzak (small world, my dad was friends with the guy who started Muzak).  Presto also supplied a lot of recorders to the military as well. They handled all sorts of adverse conditions.  The old guard I talked to said they were built like a tank.  

Sinatra had a Presto 825 in his home to listen to his tapes. 

Not a lot of engineers left who worked with Presto machines especially when you consider this machine was introduced 60 years ago.

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

www.silvertonemastering.com

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seth

Ruby Baby

Posts: 5,531 Member Since:26/01/2011

#75 [url]

Apr 9 17 7:51 PM

jzombie wrote:
Bing Crosby was heavily involved in the development of the Ampex 200, investing a lot of money in the company, as he wanted to be able to pre-tape his radio show.  In fact I believe it was Crosby who gave Les Paul his first tape machine.  

 

That's what I read as well, that Crosby financed Ampex. There's a story about Crosby going over to Les' house with an Ampex machine in the trunk of his car.

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chance

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,634 Member Since:30/01/2011

#76 [url]

Apr 9 17 9:50 PM

seth wrote:

jzombie wrote:
Bing Crosby was heavily involved in the development of the Ampex 200, investing a lot of money in the company, as he wanted to be able to pre-tape his radio show.  In fact I believe it was Crosby who gave Les Paul his first tape machine.  


 

That's what I read as well, that Crosby financed Ampex. There's a story about Crosby going over to Les' house with an Ampex machine in the trunk of his car.

Yes! "thats" the story I remember

Chance Pataki The Musicians Workshop www.the-musicians-workshop.com musicians.workshop@gte.net

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maarvold

Aqua Marine

Posts: 3,023 Member Since:23/01/2011

#77 [url]

Apr 9 17 11:53 PM

This is based on a pretty fuzzy memory, but I heard Bing brought the first 3 tape machines into the US.  It seems to me it was around wartime... something about someone hearing orchestral music on the radio that they knew--because of the time and place of the broadcast--that had to be a playback, but had vastly superior quality to the wire recorders available at that time; that was the first clue that the Germans were onto something new in the technology dept.  Please don't crucify me if I'm wrong--it's a pretty fuzzy memory.  And I do think it had to do with Bing not wanting to have to always be 'live' at the times he was supposed to be on the air.  

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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#79 [url]

Apr 10 17 5:19 AM

It seems both the Ampex and the Presto were based on the Magnetophon (which makes perfect sense).... below I is part of the story on Presto (taken from the Presto History page)... Engineers from Presto went on to a Scully to eventually redesigned their transports, it's an interesting history (here is a short excerpt). http://www.prestohistory.com/Presto.htm

"During the world war II years, Presto was heavily involved with government and military production. Through George Saliba's contacts with MIT, Presto was able to secure contracts for building such equipment as Location/Range finding equipment installed in NY harbor to detect submarines;test equipment for Radar installations/ Long Range Navigation for overseas lend/lease; as well as developing navigation simulation equipment for the Marines training for the Invasion of Japan (2). For these services, Presto was awarded the prestigious Army-Navy E award for it's help in the war effort.

After the war, Presto, who had relied heavily on their disc recording equipment, needed to expand for the future. Some one involved with the Nuemberg Trials at wars end, friends with the Principles at Presto, sent 2 German tape recorders used at the trials to Presto. They were military models, brand unknown, but must have been Magnetophone recorders. They were very ruggedly built, and were of the three motor design (2). That action resulted in Presto entering the tape recorder field.

Since Bing Crosby Enterprises had invested money in Ampex,developing the tape recorder at about the same time, Presto was in a catch up mode, and never reached the success of Ampex in acceptance. Many broadcast stations who had their disc equipment, purchased their tape recorders. Presto stayed with the 3 motor design, and never entered the home consumer market.

Arthur Gruber, son of Morris, worked for a time for Presto designing the tape transport systems of their later models. Shortly after the company was sold, he and several other engineers were employed by Scully and re-designed the Scully tape recorders, which were very advanced in their field at that time. Arthur was chief engineer and vice president of Scully Recording Corp from 1961 to 1968. Arthur died November 27,2001.

Presto also was help to CBS Labs in the development of the Long Play 33 1/3 microgroove record (2)."

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

www.silvertonemastering.com

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seth

Ruby Baby

Posts: 5,531 Member Since:26/01/2011

#80 [url]

Apr 10 17 8:04 AM

There was a great biography of Crosby some years ago that was supposed to be in two parts, though I don't think a second part ever came out. He really wanted to play golf or go to the track in the daytime and the network wanted him to do live broadcasts, which would be late afternoon on the west coast for an east coast early evening show. So he invested in Ampex to make pre-recording viable, and he had the power to make it a standard practice when it became viable. Anyone remember when TV shows used to say, "This program was pre-recorded"?

Here's that book: https://www.amazon.com/Bing-Crosby-Pocketful-Dreams-1903-1940/dp/0316886459/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1491829420&sr=1-3&keywords=Bing+Crosby

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