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barkleymckay

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Posts: 1,362 Member Since: 22/01/2011

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Mar 2 14 5:45 PM

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Hi Bill and most gracious fellow members.

Does anybody here have experience with live audio streaming from their studio computers?

We have being doing shows from our studio to Concert Window (www.concertwindow.com) with audio and video feeds.

All good - but for some reason I cannot get the browser or the flash plugin (12.0.0.70) to stream the right channel audio within the Concert Window setup pane.

If I use built in Line Inputs - Left Only
If I use an MBox 2 - Left only
If I use my RME 800 - Left only

But the audio in all cases records into a DAW fine on both channels so it cannot be my input state. The Fireface Mixer also shows all inputs and outputs are ok.

Is Flash 12.0.0.70 mono upload stream only?

The only way I could get it to stream the audio in stereo was using Flash Media Live Encoder and unique  - but this is now a bit of a ballache to work with external USB cameras I have available - though it works fine with the built in camera.
Go figure

So my options so far are this:
Use the Concert Window input pane and have a remote camera and mono audio stream
Use FMLE for stereo audio, but have to feedback to another macbook and use its internal camera as FMLE does not recognise the camera as a valid video stream.

Concert Window themselves don't seem to think there is a problem and are adamant that their website can stream a stereo feed - though the majority of users just use built in mic so I'm not 100% sure they have really checked..

thanks

Barks

 
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spiritwalker

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Posts: 3,710 Member Since:14/02/2011

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Mar 3 14 10:55 AM

This sounds very interesting and something I would like to maybe try up here in Iceville.

Would you consider sharing an outline of your complete setup for doing this?

Norm

OK it's cold here

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podgorny

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Posts: 2,351 Member Since:27/01/2011

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Mar 3 14 7:40 PM

Not sure what you mean by "They seem to think audio is only streamed if it's a file - not live" I've never rused Concert Window, but I've used FMLE plenty and never had any issues.

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barkleymckay

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Posts: 1,362 Member Since:22/01/2011

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Mar 4 14 3:24 AM

Hi Kyle.
My problem is not with FMLE - as I mentioned - but with the way Flash 12 deals with my audio feed within Concert Window.

I don't seem to be getting any response as to why it (Flash 12) is ignoring the right channel. How does the Core Audio interface with The Browser then the Flash Player?
The Flash (note NOT FMLE - sorry I should have been clearer) ) user base seem to think that Flash 12 will spit out automatically what you put in - which is clearly not the case - and keep referring me to FMLE people.
I will end up using FMLE for our next show in a few days, but the other problem is that it does not like the external camera I have as a valid source so I have to find another video source quickly and time is not exactly on my side.

Concert Window's system would be ideal - if it worked - which is why I'm asking questions and trying to understand how this all fits together!
Maybe you could help here?

for information, this is the Concert Window setup page.
Note how Flash calls the audio input page option Microphone.
image

Last Edited By: barkleymckay Mar 4 14 3:43 AM. Edited 2 times.

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barkleymckay

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Mar 8 14 11:10 AM

Ok, being doing some research before our next broadcast and have found a few useful things.

As mentioned, I cannot  get the Concert Window website's built in audio/video Flash12 terminal to recognise the right channel of my live feed.
I think this may be a browser related issue - but have no info as to how Flash 12, via the browser,  interacts with the audio engine of my computer.

Sooo, I have to use Flash Live Media Encoder (FMLE) if I want to do stereo audio broadcast - using the .xml file supplied by ConcertWindow that links it back to Concert Window so that we can have live interaction with the audience, and more importantly get the revenue stream!
Concert Window has some good things going for it but I have to use Flash products.

The problem was that FMLE did not like the external camera I had - whereas the in built terminal in Concert Window was fine with the camera.
Ugh - you fix one problem to only get another.
I want quality mixed live audio via my control room and a decent image. Nothing worse than a good image and crappy-outside critical distance-sound via an iPad mic etc.

So my next bit of research found CamTwist - a free application that enables you to "grab" multiple cameras connected by USB.

http://camtwiststudio.com/

First thing I found:
As long as you open CamTwist first - thus grabbing all the sources - FMLE  sees CamTwist as the source when you open it.
Bingo! The unrecognised camera is streaming into FMLE...

Second thing:
CamTwist has a Studio page that enables you to live switch between the camera sources it has grabbed. This switching includes fades and effects.
All this works seamlessly in FMLE - great I now have multiple live camera sources!

We are looking now at doing little broadcasts from our studio with clients and now I can have quality mixed audio via the console and live mixing of video feeds.

will keep you posted.

 

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spiritwalker

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Mar 8 14 12:18 PM

Please could you share what gear you are using besides the software?

What cameras?
Are they all connected via USB?
What computer configuration?
Is there anyway to connect in iphones?

Can you tell me how many GB of data you stream/hr? Or some sort of ratio/rate of data use.
This really interests me but our internet costs up here in the North Pole are $160.00/month for basic cable/phone and 90 GB of data.

Thanks

Norm

OK it's cold here

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barkleymckay

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Posts: 1,362 Member Since:22/01/2011

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Mar 8 14 2:01 PM

spiritwalker wrote:
Please could you share what gear you are using besides the software?

What cameras?
Are they all connected via USB?
What computer configuration?
Is there anyway to connect in iphones?

Can you tell me how many GB of data you stream/hr? Or some sort of ratio/rate of data use.
This really interests me but our internet costs up here in the North Pole are $160.00/month for basic cable/phone and 90 GB of data.

Thanks

Norm
 

Hi Norm,

We are using an iMac from 2011 running OS 10.6.8.
I have a Logitech C210 USB camera and a Microsoft  LifeCam HD-3000 camera. Both plug and play.

The two cameras plug into the iMac and (now) get picked up by the CamTwist software first - which enables me to switch video feeds into Flash Media Live Encoder (FMLE)
FMLE *sees* CamTwist as the video input when you open it up AFTER CamTwist.

FLME streams the feed to the Flash servers on the Internet.
Concert Window supplies the .xml file that you open as a file in FMLE so that it knows the location online to stream your live feed.

As far as internet goes we pay about £15 per month broadband - but there is no limit to what we can upload or download.
I'm not sure what the size of the data being transmitted amounts to.
Seems a totally different setup to yours!

Audio wise, I'm setting up mics in front of the musicians as normal via XLR snake and routing to my control room console to make a good audio balance on the studio monitors.
My iMac is there with me -it is the studio computer - connected via an RME Fireface 800 interface - which is receiving the audio from the console mix bus to inputs 1&2
The USB cameras are connected to the same computer via really long USB cable extensions coming through the wall.

So I have:

USB Cameras > iMac > CamTwist > FMLE
Audio Mics > Console > Fireface800 > FMLE

Video feed selected in FMLE video window - Camtwist
Audio feed selected in FMLE audio window - Fireface 800 inputs 1&2

All seems good.

FMLE allows you to configure the bit rate, audio rate, frame rate etc to get the best performance from your system. We have about 1MB upload speed which is the bare minimum.

As for iPhones I'm not sure - but a lot of shows on Concert Window seem to be streamed live - maybe via 3g or 4g - from iPads using built in camera and mic.
I'd guess if you had iPad compliant software and audio interface you could still select that.
Don't think FMLE is iPad (or iOS) compliant so you'd have to use the Concert Window set ups on line - which would limit you to mono audio it seems!

hope this helps. I'm new to this but you learn quick.

Barks
 

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barkleymckay

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Posts: 1,362 Member Since:22/01/2011

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Mar 14 14 4:19 PM

Pleased to to report it went really well!

Audio and video captured via FMLE and transmitted.
One oddity was that FMLE displayed the left/right meter the wrong way round which was a bit disconcerting as I planned to pan the guitars to match the image - so I had to figure out how to do a test broadcast.
Thankfully provision has now been made for this in Concert Window. They are really good at listening to feedback and implementing changes - but it seems don't quite understand the mono only deal with the built in flash setting in their website!

I also wired the iMac direct to the modem using Ethernet. Performance was notably better with less jerky video than before when using WiFi

Mic on each source - Oktava 012 in omni suspended in the double bass bridge and Oktava 219 (favourite of mine) on vocals (my lovely wife Kitty). The vocal mic also got a nice blend of her acoustic when she played so no need to put another one in there. Sennheiser MD441 on both acoustic guitars.
Touch of compression on vocal and bass and we where good to go.
I had to initially balance myself with a pair of headphones and then readjust back at the desk in the control room. Otherwise it was a pilotless mix!

We got a lot of commendation about the sound quality which was a great relief - and nobody mentioned that the video feed was crap. This is an area I need to research more, especially types of camera and how to manage streaming rates etc, to get optimum results with limited bandwidth.

It was a lot of fun -  especially communicating via messaging in real time with people as far as Japan and San Francisco on an iPad next to K.
It's odd not hearing any applause but seeing it typed in the message window!

Next concert is in a month with a jazz trio - acoustic piano ,double bass and drums - which I also intend using two cameras with in real time.


image

Last Edited By: barkleymckay Mar 14 14 4:36 PM. Edited 5 times.

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