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crandallwarren

Tin Man

Posts: 16 Member Since:17/11/2014

#21 [url]

Nov 25 14 12:54 PM

I think all the comments about visual appearance, etc are totally valid. I think it depends on the show and what the relationship is between venue, artist, client, etc. In both of the cases I described, the client and the artist were the same people and they had rented out the venue. So, as long as the was cool with it-- I pretty much had permission to put up whatever I wanted wherever I wanted because their priority was the recording. Its definitely more complicated if, say, a touring band is being presented by a venue and they've hired you directly to come and record. In that situation,  the venue pretty much has the right to not help you in any way... Not to say that they would or wouldn't. But I've experienced both.

More and more, I find myself trying to be as independent from FOH and Mons as possible. Both to respect the professional boundary and to ensure my own product. My line of thought is: if the client is paying me to record the show, I alone am 100% responsible for making sure that happens. I'd like to have the ability to independantly mic every single thing on stage, even if I never need to actually do it. Otherwise, I'm placing too large a portion of my job on the house crew and its equipment. I know when I'm FOH engineer, my philosophy towards recording guys is "I'll do what I can to help you, but my #1 priority is to the audience in the room..." . So, if FOH needs to mic the acoustic guitar with a 57, I'm not inclined to tell him otherwise. I'd rather just put up my own mic. The same goes for the splits. If flipping the ground cleans it up for me, but dirties it for him-- who gets priority? Usually the house. Because at that exact moment, my probelm affects me-- FOH's problem affects a lot of people...



 

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bill mueller

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,350 Member Since:20/01/2011

#22 [url]

Nov 26 14 1:41 PM

What a great thread. I'm sorry I'm so late to the party! I agree with all the great advice here. I just looked back at the OP and have a comment. Ground reference issues tend to create 60hz hum and buzzes tend to be induced by other sources. Lifting grounds won't usually change induced high frequency noise. Try to find the lighting, or refrigerator/air conditioner circuit or even a computer that is inducing noise into your lines. I very much like your approach to respecting the FOH and monitor engineer. They are your best friends or worst enemies and it's pretty much up to you how that goes.

I agree that for an off the shelf analog solution, the Radial OX-8 look pretty good. However, personally, I would be looking into a digital stage box because of the downside of carrying 600 lbs of snake around. Been there, done that. There is a pretty good selection of digital stage box systems available that might be a lighter weight option.

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mario i

Platinum Blonde

Posts: 1,581 Member Since:28/01/2011

#23 [url]

Dec 3 14 8:09 PM

Having just picked up a used 24ch X 8return snake I was apauled at the condition of wires in the XLR's...and a few broken XLR's

Frayed and disconnected or about to disconnect...

Initally the tester only showed 6 duds...I decided to go through each one and they all needed re-soldering...

I couldn't help but think how much trouble I would've had if I relied solely on the tester...

M

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crandallwarren

Tin Man

Posts: 16 Member Since:17/11/2014

#24 [url]

Dec 10 14 12:23 PM

Thanks again, everybody. Bill-- those are great points. Every issue I was having was definitely more in the buzz category and not the 60Hz variety. I think you might be right about the lighting cables. That would make sense given the fact that the buzzes on different channels were often out of phase with one another-- if they were crossing the lighting cables at different locations, etc. In the future, it seems like if the fixes at the split aren't working (ground lifts, etc) maybe it's a good idea to walk the path of a particular channel and see if there's any glaring conditions. Thanks again everyone!

C.

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RobAnderson

New Forum Friend

Posts: 4 Member Since:17/01/2015

#25 [url]

Jan 17 15 2:24 PM

I've not had any trouble with a UPS causing buzz (even the cheap ones), provided it is plugged into a properly wired, grounded outlet (and/or the sound system you are interfacing with is also plugged into a properly wired/grounded circuit. I digress...). Also, do your utmost to be on the same circuit as the sound system (and not the lights, bar fridge, HVAC system, etc.)

Cheap mic cables with improper shielding can pick up lighting buzz rather well - even older "wrapped shield" cables may have compromised shielding.

Placing a transformer iso split anywhere near a strong hum field can also cause problems.

If you're looking to invest, the Radial splits (especially the Jensen ones) are great, but I think they use Phoenix and DSUB connectors, so you'll need breakout cables, or to build some sort of connector panel.

If you don't have a lot of bread to spend and/or prefer XLR connectors right out of the box, I can say that the ART S8 splits work pretty well for the money (get the 2-way ones - the 3-way don't seem to have per-channel ground lift switches). Whirlwind also makes rackmount 4-channel splits, as well as a stagebox splitter in iso and non-iso versions. They may not be quite as nice as the Radial, but are perfectly serviceable.

IMHO Isolated splits are an absolute necessity for live multitrack stuff, unless you want to double mic everything (which is rarely a practical option). Also, properly advancing the gig by communicating with the live sound company/crew so that there are no (well, less) surprises at the gig can pay lots of dividends.

http://www.facebook.com/AndersonSoundRecording
http://andersonsoundrecording.com/

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crandallwarren

Tin Man

Posts: 16 Member Since:17/11/2014

#26 [url]

Jan 24 15 12:52 PM

Thanks again for the great advice. As luck would gave it, I have a rematch tonight-- same venue, same rig. I'm gonna try some stuff outlined here. I'll report back!

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RobAnderson

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Posts: 4 Member Since:17/01/2015

#27 [url]

Jan 26 15 7:27 PM

crandallwarren wrote:
Thanks again for the great advice. As luck would gave it, I have a rematch tonight-- same venue, same rig. I'm gonna try some stuff outlined here. I'll report back!

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crandallwarren

Tin Man

Posts: 16 Member Since:17/11/2014

#29 [url]

Jan 30 15 12:08 AM

Good call you guys. Can you elaborate a little on what you'd be looking for? I understand checking for voltage being too high or the ground not being grounded, etc.

What issues would arise as a result of the outlet having its phase reversed?

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