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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#83 [url]

Apr 10 17 11:44 AM

Just reading the history of Presto is so interesting.

I knew the Ampex story but just about everybody associated with Presto are gone now. So it's the History through their kids memories or what can be found in print from back in the day. Very interesting nonetheless.

Bob will be back from Nashville this week. I'm hoping to get down there next week sometime to take a look and/or pick her up. I think I'm going to rent a box van with a ramp as opposed to try to get this thing in the back of my pickup truck. Been there, done that, my back isn't what it use to be. Good thing Sundazed has an elevator as Bobs mastering rooms are on the third story of his building!

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

www.silvertonemastering.com

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waltzingbear

Platinum Blonde

Posts: 1,231 Member Since:16/07/2012

#84 [url]

Apr 10 17 12:04 PM

OK, here are the links to the early history of magnetic tape recording development.

Ampex, Presto, Rangertone, etc all follow from these.

Crosby provided money to Ampex to finish development of the first Ampex (the 200)

etc.

Cheers and good reading
Alan



Below is a link to a pdf of a BBC technical assessment generated at the end of WWII in Britain regarding the various Magnetophone recorders.

Thanks to Goran Finnberg for pointing this paper out on the Ampex list.

www.cdvandt.org/BIOS-915.pdf

The report at cdvandt.com/BIOS-915.pdf is 128 pages
Iong and was prepared by the British Intelligence
Organization Sub-commmittee.

B.I.O.S. for short.

The B.I.O.S report to me is much more interesting than
the two above BBC publications alone that is the reason
I gave that link despite the scan is a little bit worse
compared to the BBC scan for the first 9 pages only.

Pages 10-20 contains BBC re-engineered schematics
of the Magnetophon K7.

The BIOS report have even more detailed schematics
of the K7.

Together with a comparison between the K4, HTS and K7.

But the most interesting thing is the report from the war
prisoner RRG Chief Engineer Dr. Hans Joachim von
Braunmuhl as appendix IV.

Dr Braunmuhl:

"The quantity of Magnetophon tape used by the RRG
accordingly rose to 5000 kilometres/ month" ! !

Also a part about Stereophonic reproduction !

Also ALL the relevant patents up to June 3rd 1944.



If you haven't visited the Historical Committee site
http://www.aes.org/aeshc/ recently, may I recommend that you give it a
look.

You can easily see "What's New" at
http://www.aes.org/aeshc/whatsnew.html

The latest is "Development of Coated Tape and the Magnetophon in
Germany"
http://www.aes.org/aeshc/docs/magnetic-recording/magnetophon/development-of-the-magnetophon.html
thanks to Friedrich Engel, Richard Hess, and Bill Wray for
putting this together. It isn't yet absolutely complete, but most of
the really important stuff is there.

You might also be interested in last-years "new" item "AC-Bias at Bell
Telephone Labs, 1936-1939"
http://www.aes.org/aeshc/pdf/mcknight_ac-bias-at-btl-1936-1939.pdf .

http://www.aes.org/aeshc/books+vids/pre-1943.mag.hist.html


There's a nice paper on Walter Weber and his work: "Walter Weber's
Technical Innovation at the Reichs-Rundfunk-Gesellschaft"
by Friedrich Engel, online at
www.richardhess.com/tape/history/Engel--Walter_Weber_2006.pdf

It discusses their stereo recording, and shows a drawing of their
2-track head.


Magnetophon HTS
http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/publications/rdreport_1946_10
a much better reproduction than the link at cdvandt.com

EMI BTR1
http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/publications/rdreport_1948_30

Here is the link to the Magnetophon K7 system that is
included in the BIOS version, 9 out of 20 pages:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/publications/rdreport_1946_14

Alan Garren
Waltzing Bear Audio

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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#85 [url]

Apr 10 17 2:16 PM

Wow Alan, that's some bit of data. I've read a few of those but now I gots me some weekend reading to do!

Thank you.

So educated me, without the sel sync I cut to all three tracks at once? I can't do the old record onto two tracks and bounce to the third and free up the first two, etc... correct? Not really what I want to do with this machine anyway.

In the simplest sense, if I need to say record a lead vocal later on, could I record the music on 1 & 3 for left and right and later put the vocal in the middle?... I suppose this wouldn't work either as it would be delayed b the distance of the playback head to the record head. Am I thinking this correctly?

Thanks for the lesson in advance.

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

www.silvertonemastering.com

Last Edited By: silvertone Apr 10 17 2:25 PM. Edited 1 time.

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waltzingbear

Platinum Blonde

Posts: 1,231 Member Since:16/07/2012

#86 [url]

Apr 10 17 2:45 PM

all depends on the erase head, some were full track and some were individual channels.

sel sync for any/all dubbing into later, otherwise its a bounce

Alan

Alan Garren
Waltzing Bear Audio

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waltzingbear

Platinum Blonde

Posts: 1,231 Member Since:16/07/2012

#87 [url]

Apr 10 17 3:00 PM

barry hufker wrote:
Jack Mullin brought the first tape recorders (Magnetophon) to the U.S.  American recorders were based on that.

effectively true, not quite totally true,

Jack Mullin brought the first tape recorders to the US that were used for later development of real commercial products, AEG showed the Magnetophone to GE and RCA around 1936, neither was interested. It was still DC bias at that time, AC bias was adopted during the war, see the article on Richard Hess's web page for that story.

Alan

 

Alan Garren
Waltzing Bear Audio

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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#88 [url]

Apr 11 17 5:46 PM

Well here she is... I go down to get her next week...

 imageimageimageimageimageimage

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

www.silvertonemastering.com

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hank alrich

Platinum Blonde

Posts: 1,739 Member Since:28/01/2011

#90 [url]

Apr 11 17 6:26 PM

Just friggin' WOW! That machine is truly beautiful to my eye. I love that you can do this. Seriously. "Silver tone", indeed.

hank alrich
http://hankandshaidrimusic.com/
http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic

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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#92 [url]

Apr 11 17 7:00 PM

hank alrich wrote:
Just friggin' WOW! That machine is truly beautiful to my eye. I love that you can do this. Seriously. "Silver tone", indeed.

Thanks Hank.  I agree on that "true beauty". 

I really can't afford to do this but I feel I can't afford not to. I mean I have the console to go with it, so I sort of just have to get on with it.  The fact that this other piece of unobtainium has come my way makes me think the stars have aligned and I should probably pay attention.  

I bring the bachoe in this weekend to start digging to build the echo chamber under the parking lot.  Ha ha  only kidding! Hmmmmmm....

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

www.silvertonemastering.com

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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#94 [url]

Apr 12 17 7:08 AM

Thanks Brad and Scullyfan, I think so myself.

This will be quite the challenge I'm sure. Will make learning and using Pro Tools seem like child's play. Ha ha

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

www.silvertonemastering.com

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soapfoot

Ruby Baby

Posts: 7,207 Member Since:04/02/2011

#95 [url]

Apr 12 17 7:47 AM

Larry, do you have a good grand piano?

If so, I bet there are a few jazz musicians in NYC who would travel upstate to record "just like they recorded at Columbia 30th st on the classic records." If they were aware, and it were marketed as such, etc. A niche interest for sure, but probably at least a few projects a year.

brad allen williams

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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#96 [url]

Apr 12 17 8:35 AM

soapfoot wrote:
Larry, do you have a good grand piano?

If so, I bet there are a few jazz musicians in NYC who would travel upstate to record "just like they recorded at Columbia 30th st on the classic records." If they were aware, and it were marketed as such, etc. A niche interest for sure, but probably at least a few projects a year.

Unfortunately, I don't Brad.  My neighbor wants to give me her turn of the Century Steinway (which sounds gorgeous) but I would have to build an addition onto the studio to make that fit unfortunately.  It really would be worth it.

I was thinking of trying to partner up with a studio in the downstate area near NY or NJ who might want to do some "period" type recording as well.  Dreamland, Clubhouse, etc... If I did that the equipment would have to be installed there and not moved. So I'm hesitant for now.  I'll just get her going for now and work her with some local jazz, rock and bluegrass bands while I learn her idiosyncrasies. 

I have gotten interest from several producers that I know already.  I think they would like to work this way again.  

I'm also thinking of coming up with some set price for the day but doing the actual session for free.  If everybody likes what they hear, then and only then, would they have to pay me for my time. Maybe have some set 50.00 or 75.00 non refundable fee to cover electricity and wear and tear.  Kind of a no risk policy that only costs everyone their time if they are not happy with the results.  All groups would be vetted first.

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

www.silvertonemastering.com

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soapfoot

Ruby Baby

Posts: 7,207 Member Since:04/02/2011

#97 [url]

Apr 12 17 8:48 AM

I wish you luck, Larry. I wish we could build a "C" room just for such a setup! Keep us posted, and send pictures etc. when you have it all set up!

brad allen williams

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gold

Platinum Blonde

Posts: 1,494 Member Since:27/01/2011

#98 [url]

Apr 12 17 1:36 PM

Maybe there is a small Church around you that is under utilized? You might be able to get a day rate.

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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#99 [url]

Apr 13 17 5:37 AM

We do have the Universal Preservation Hall here now, which is an old Baptist church that was converted to a concert venue. I was hired to consult. My 4 Ampex AO58 tube amps came from there. All had 4 original Mullard EL84's in them, 4 of them per amp. They were sitting by the dumpster. The tubes alone are worth 100.00 each! I asked if I could have them they said sure.

Apparently the week before they took sledgehammers to 40 Celestion cabinets and threw those in the dumpster! I tried to rescue the custom 3 keyboard Hammond B3 they had done in this ornate oak cabinet from Hammond. By the time I got back there 4 days later they had done the same thing they did with the Celestions. I wanted to cry.

Anyway, thanks for the reminder. Universal Hall looks just like Mechanics Hall over in Mass. Could be a great room to use, I'll have to go over and talk to them.

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

www.silvertonemastering.com

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silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,677 Member Since:26/01/2011

#100 [url]

Apr 13 17 6:46 AM

If you look at the pictures it looks like this Presto 825 might have the sel sync built into it.

Any pictures I've seem of others don't have the 3 knob box that's located in the upper left corner that this one has. Hard to read but above #1 it looks to say "sync".

I guess I'll find out on Tuesday as that's when I go to get her.

Silvertone Mastering, celebrating 28 years in business.

www.silvertonemastering.com

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