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gtoledo3

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Posts: 4,169 Member Since: 23/10/2013

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Dec 13 16 9:01 PM

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I happened to run across this old post from Neumann's Uwe Sattler, and it is such an outlier opinion, it seems like an interesting conversation starter at the very least.

"I am aware of the flak this statement will generate, but ... actually, if it is properly done, there is nothing 'wrong' with the U47 N (nuvistor tube in place of the V14) and I doubt that many people (if any) would be able to hear the difference ...  "

http://www.neumann.com/forums/view.php?site=neumann&bn=neumann_mictec&key=1269888026
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ssltech

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#1 [url]

Dec 13 16 9:58 PM

I will say this:

A good friend has two U47N's, and has owned them for a quarter century or more. He always wanted more "size" from them, and was never happy with their low end.

Oliver Archut (may he rest in peace) suggested I try David Bock's idea of using a BV11 in place of the BV8. I did it to one of the two microphones and kept the second 'stock' as a 'control' reference.

There is simply NO comparison. The BV11 makes the U47N into the mic it SHOULD have been.

There absolutely IS something "wrong" with the Nuvistor 47. And I have a confidence so solid that you could hammer nails into it that ANYONE who hears the mod will agree.

This is NOT subtle.

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ssltech

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#2 [url]

Dec 13 16 10:02 PM

Perhaps the phrase "If properly done" is key.

The BV8 -in my opinion- was NOT the proper transformer to use. The BV11 is a simple conversion to "properly done".

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gtoledo3

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#3 [url]

Dec 13 16 10:14 PM

Oh, I see.

I am inferring that the impedance relationship is such that the BV11 winds up being much more suitable. How interesting.

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podgorny

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Posts: 2,339 Member Since:27/01/2011

#4 [url]

Dec 14 16 12:16 AM

I can only add that I've used VF14 mics that sounded like plops, and Nuvistor mics that sounded as good as any I've ever used.

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maarvold

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#5 [url]

Dec 14 16 10:47 AM

podgorny wrote:
I can only add that I've used VF14 mics that sounded like plops, and Nuvistor mics that sounded as good as any I've ever used.

 
One of the best-sounding 47's I have ever used (on female vocals) was a short body 47 that I was told had a Nuvistor; I used that mic at George Massenburg's The Complex studios.  It did not have the 'big baritone' U47 thing that I think most people expect from a 47/48, but it was a great-sounding mic.  

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scullyfan

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#6 [url]

Dec 14 16 5:05 PM

A friend brought his U47 (Nuvistor) over to my studio so we could hear the difference between his and my U47 with VF14M and original capsule. I have to say they sounded very close in the middle range, but his lacked the signature "tubby" bottom that I always associate with a U47.

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gtoledo3

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Posts: 4,169 Member Since:23/10/2013

#7 [url]

Dec 15 16 12:25 AM

I wonder if the safe conclusion here is that nuvistor + BV8 winds up making a nice mic, less pronounced bottom than stock U47...

... while nuvistor + BV11 brings the bass end back closer to the VF14k + BV8 combo, though maybe not precisely the same.

However, I have heard some people criticize the nuvistor from a tube design standpoint, saying it's microphonic. I'm a little skeptical that it would be flat out microphonic though.

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jesse decarlo

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#8 [url]

Dec 19 16 4:33 PM

I've used a friend's U47 nuvistor a bit - really liked it on female vocals, not so much on male vocals, and kind of disliked it for tenor sax.

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bockaudio

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#9 [url]

May 17 17 9:35 PM

ssltech wrote:
Perhaps the phrase "If properly done" is key.

The BV8 -in my opinion- was NOT the proper transformer to use. The BV11 is a simple conversion to "properly done".

As much as I respect Sattler, he's wrong on this. The plate impeadance of the two tubes is radically different, they could never sound the same with the same transformer. So as Kieth has heard my mod idea (swap the BV8 for a BV11) does work here. BUT looking back at statements made by Bore (who did excellent workotherwise), the main guy at Neumann in the late 50's and early 1960's, he was unappologetic about the U47fet not sounding like a U47, and designed a transistor AC701 substitute that sounds NOTHING like an AC701, so I think it's safe to say his position was that the customer should move on, and forget the VF14 sounding U47's.

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