avatar

nid

New Forum Friend

Posts: 3 Member Since:06/01/2012

#21 [url]

Jan 6 12 5:51 PM

Hi. I guess you've been talking about carbon faders so far. What about plastic conductive faders? We have the Japan-made TKD. They were super smooth when new (it's been about 2 years now) but lately most of them have become harder. Absolutely no problem working with them, just worried if there is some kind of wear by friction or something. The room is smoke-free but we NEVER cover the desk and there is a significant amount of dust in the place (city environment, garden at the back, wood burning stove in the next room). Is this really an issue or is it minuscule? I don't know of many studios that cover their desks anyway.

The (German) distributor of TKD had then told me this:
the faders are already lubricated. 
Depending on the dust, you must clean the faders every few month, especially at the ends of the tracks.
Every second time you can add some new ace free lubricate. The consistence you can choose, depending on your feeling.
You can't make any mistake. You only must take ace free lubricate. That's very important!

I'm not at all sure how this clean-up process he talks about is being done or what the ace free lubricant is.

Quote    Reply   
avatar

silvertone

Aqua Marine

Posts: 2,774 Member Since:26/01/2011

#23 [url]

Jan 9 12 8:17 AM

Whats funny is the old Duncan, Langevin and Gliss fader instructions told you to use Vasoline as the lubricant... see it wasn't just for cowlicks.

One of my young techs just about had a heart attack when I showed him that... the old tech's, not so much...

Quote    Reply   
avatar

ssltech

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,058 Member Since:22/01/2011

#24 [url]

Jan 9 12 8:37 AM

Hi. I guess you've been talking about carbon faders so far. What about plastic conductive faders?

-nid



Nope. -Conductive plastic.

You probably don't want to concern yourself about the conductive material if the fader is working correctly.

If you're talking about 'feel' and 'stiffness' then it's almost certainly got nothing to do with it. I don't think I've ever encountered a fader where the friction of the wiper against the conductive material has been responsible for making the fader feel 'stiff'.

Instead, the slide-rails (usually a polished nickel or chrome) and any bushings which slide along them (they may be nylon or some soft bearing metal) are the only things which need to be addressed.

Clean.  Polish.  Lubricate.

Assuming that the bushing/s aren't worn to a point where they cause the slider to 'gall' (which I've seen on some Penny & Giles SSL master faders) then that's all you need to do.

-Keith Andrews -If I can't fix it, I can fix it so [i]NOBODY[/i] can fix it!

Quote    Reply   
avatar

nid

New Forum Friend

Posts: 3 Member Since:06/01/2012

#25 [url]

Jan 16 12 4:42 AM


Nope. -Conductive plastic.


You probably don't want to concern yourself about the conductive material if the fader is working correctly.
If you're talking about 'feel' and 'stiffness' then it's almost certainly got nothing to do with it. I don't think I've ever encountered a fader where the friction of the wiper against the conductive material has been responsible for making the fader feel 'stiff'.
Instead, the slide-rails (usually a polished nickel or chrome) and any bushings which slide along them (they may be nylon or some soft bearing metal) are the only things which need to be addressed.



Clean.  Polish.  Lubricate.


Assuming that the bushing/s aren't worn to a point where they cause the slider to 'gall' (which I've seen on some Penny & Giles SSL master faders) then that's all you need to do.

-ssltech


thanks a ton. So if I get it right, lubricants like DeoxIT FaderGrease are useful only when there are problems with the taper surface. Otherwise it's best to avoid them (?) and in general avoid putting anything on the conductive material (?). So, no precaution measures needed here?


Quote    Reply   
avatar

ssltech

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,058 Member Since:22/01/2011

#26 [url]

Jan 16 12 7:01 AM

Deoxit itself isn't really a lubricant, it's a surface cleaner, haven't tried the 'fader grease', but yes, it's not something that I would apply unless there was something wrong or 'scratchy' with the fader... a sort of "don't fix what ain't broke" ruling.

As always; be careful/mindful of the wiper/conductive track, since the wiper is fragile, and the track too is easily damaged.

If your 'gummy-feeling' problem comes from sticky slides (which it usually does) then I'd leave the rest alone.

-Keith Andrews -If I can't fix it, I can fix it so [i]NOBODY[/i] can fix it!

Quote    Reply   
avatar

wireline

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,123 Member Since:24/01/2011

#27 [url]

Jan 16 12 8:17 AM

We had some real fader problems with my Wheatstone SP5 (maintenance free since the late 80s...)  After a thorough cleaning with DeOxit, used less than a dab of trombone slider oil on each raid (P&G 104MMs) and have been trouble free, happy fading for over a year now...

If that makes any sense.

Ken Morgan

Please...Give It A Rest

Quote    Reply   
avatar

ssltech

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,058 Member Since:22/01/2011

#28 [url]

Jan 16 12 9:14 AM

Yep, brass instrument valve oil is what I use.

'La Tromba' is about the very best I've ever used, though I've never seen it for sale in the USA. 'Al Cass' slide/valve oil seems to be fairly common, and -while not quite as 'Rolls-Royce' an oil for the demands of brass instrument usage, it still seems to be plenty good enough for super-smooth fader slide rails.

-Keith Andrews -If I can't fix it, I can fix it so [i]NOBODY[/i] can fix it!

Quote    Reply   
avatar

wireline

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,123 Member Since:24/01/2011

#29 [url]

Jan 16 12 9:22 AM

I gotta admit that when my tech suggested using the same thing band nerds use to slick up their bone, I was a bit hesitant a first.  Works well though - as a fader lube - no idea about any other legit or implied usage

Ken Morgan

Please...Give It A Rest

Quote    Reply   
avatar

zmix

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,162 Member Since:20/01/2011

#30 [url]

Jan 31 12 8:00 PM

I was cleaning one of my P&G motorized faders, and it was really showing a remarkable improvement... when suddenly the thread unspooled and went limp.. it's intact and unbroken, but:

How do you re-thread (or resnug) the thread on a P&G fader?

Quote    Reply   
avatar

ssltech

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,058 Member Since:22/01/2011

#31 [url]

Jan 31 12 8:04 PM

There are a couple of clamping screws... the usual M.O  at manufacture is to pull the thread tight, clamp and trim the excess... the problem being that once the excess is trimmed, there's not much left that you can really grab onto to pull and tension,

-Keith Andrews -If I can't fix it, I can fix it so [i]NOBODY[/i] can fix it!

Quote    Reply   
avatar

ssltech

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,058 Member Since:22/01/2011

#33 [url]

Feb 1 12 8:07 AM

Oh... where the thread slips into a slot like a screw-head (but very 'hollow')?

I think I've seen them, but not faced that dilemma.

-Keith Andrews -If I can't fix it, I can fix it so [i]NOBODY[/i] can fix it!

Quote    Reply   
avatar

zmix

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,162 Member Since:20/01/2011

#34 [url]

Feb 1 12 11:38 AM

Oh... where the thread slips into a slot like a screw-head (but very 'hollow')?
I think I've seen them, but not faced that dilemma.

-ssltech

Exactly..
 
I did manage to solve it late last night, not an easy puzzle, but do-able.

Any advice on firming up the touch sense ribbon conection? I've got one fader that's gone "read only" due to loss of touch sensing...

Quote    Reply   
avatar

ssltech

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,058 Member Since:22/01/2011

#35 [url]

Feb 1 12 11:59 AM

Is it an ALPS fader? -I've got one of thise myself which I've not been able to repair.

On P&G's it was always a case of clean the track & wiper, make sure the wiper tension was sufficient, and everything was usually golden from then on.... but the ALPS seem to be a little less 'repairable' from that aspect.

-Keith Andrews -If I can't fix it, I can fix it so [i]NOBODY[/i] can fix it!

Quote    Reply   
avatar

zmix

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,162 Member Since:20/01/2011

#36 [url]

Feb 1 12 12:12 PM

No, it's a P&G.. actually says "Made in the U.K. on the bottom.  The touch sense comes from a "flexable circuit board" which runs from the PC board and is attached to the fader "handle" with a rivet..   Oh, and it's a 100mm optical encoder (from a control surface) so no wiper...

Quote    Reply   
avatar

ssltech

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,058 Member Since:22/01/2011

#37 [url]

Feb 1 12 1:39 PM

Ohhhh.. one of those. -Oh I hate those little bar studs... I suspect the flexi-board almost without even seeing it!

-Keith Andrews -If I can't fix it, I can fix it so [i]NOBODY[/i] can fix it!

Quote    Reply   
avatar

zmix

Aqua Marine

Posts: 4,162 Member Since:20/01/2011

#38 [url]

Feb 1 12 4:46 PM

Flexiboards have always struck fear into the hearts of even the most manly repairmen...

I'd put a wire in there if I though it would last.. Perhaps a braided wire from some expired earbuds?

Quote    Reply   
Add Reply

Quick Reply

bbcode help